Ideas for Renovation - Input Needed

[TheMadPoet]

Once Neutral Zone sends me a copy of the server (Hurry hurry) I plan on doing quite a number of artistic renovations to the server to kind of spruce it up after so many years. Give it a fresh face so to speak. With computers now being more powerful than they were years ago we can afford to use some more placeables, and just a general graphic enhancement.

I won't be implementing new Haks (unless we REALLY want one, and if we're sticking with CEP 2.3 there is no reason not to add more if we want), or updating CEP (We need to test to see if it can be done easily and without much issue before we even try).

With that in mind I've thought of a few things already to do. I'd like to know what the community thinks, and I'd also like suggestions and advice. This is kind of a side project for me at the moment.

• Cleaning out old player housing. We have quite a few old houses that players just are not around to use. I suggest we remove everyone who doesn't play often and keep the housing in ERF form. This can save some server size, and open up the option for new housing if people want it.
• Re-light many areas of the server. Neverwinter Wood, Neverwinter City, and the High Road/Port Llast for start. The days are fairly fine, but nights are too bright and bland looking. Also ensure skyboxes are in every area. A few parts of the High Road have no skybox.
• Spruce up Neverwinter Wood. Change the general layout a tad. Don't move anything, but spruce the areas up and change things around slightly. This will help bring it back to life somewhat instead of the same old woods from years and years ago.
• Produce a list of overrides that are suggested to be downloaded by everyone. Not required, but suggested.

[dylan_the_rabbit]

I won't be implementing new Haks (unless we REALLY want one, and if we're sticking with CEP 2.3 there is no reason not to add more if we want), or updating CEP (We need to test to see if it can be done easily and without much issue before we even try).

I've stated on many occasions the changes I think need to be made to the server. One of the things I believe we need to do is implement some more haks, especially the PRC hakpak. www.athasreborn.com/prc/manual/

• Cleaning out old player housing. We have quite a few old houses that players just are not around to use. I suggest we remove everyone who doesn't play often and keep the housing in ERF form. This can save some server size, and open up the option for new housing if people want it.
• Re-light many areas of the server. Neverwinter Wood, Neverwinter City, and the High Road/Port Llast for start. The days are fairly fine, but nights are too bright and bland looking. Also ensure skyboxes are in every area. A few parts of the High Road have no skybox.
• Spruce up Neverwinter Wood. Change the general layout a tad. Don't move anything, but spruce the areas up and change things around slightly. This will help bring it back to life somewhat instead of the same old woods from years and years ago.
• Produce a list of overrides that are suggested to be downloaded by everyone. Not required, but suggested.

All those sound good to me.

[Neutral_Zone]

The reason why we've never used PRC is because it is not finished. Never was, never will be (the original team abandoned it long ago). I have tried the most stable release of the PRC to date, and it is VERY VERY VERY BUGGY. Additionally, that's even more haks for players to download. Not as big an issue before as it used to be, since those that still play are very dedicated, but it does pose more problems. If anything, I'd rather make my own haks to handle that sort of thing.

[Tails1879_]

The greatest difficulty with introducing PRC to Legacy of the North is the fact that the core classes have been adjusted, even at level 1. For example, the sorcerer class gets extra feats in the beginning for holding a charge and granting some core abilities like climbing. Implementing something like this would result in pretty much every character from being locked out. Plus, it'd probably break the "Enforce Legal Character" flag completely. That would be something that would require a vault wipe.

As for the rest of the points...

1. Totally agree here. We do have plenty of home areas that belong to players that haven't logged in for quite some time. I developed a list of such if we'd like to post and warn folks to 'claim' them before we export them in ERF form and remove.

2. No problem here. I had intended on adding a bunch of red and yellow paper lanterns around the camp as an idea proposed by one of my characters (Eilona) to make the area feel more inviting and act as a beacon for those lost in the woods at night. That way, if the nights are made to be even darker, people could still see around that area at least. That doesn't have to be real fire if there's concern about starting a forest fire.

3. I'd touch some of the spawns as well to make them less crazy and more forgiving for low-leveled characters. Wolverines are still the most terrifying creature to spawn when you're only, what, level 4? If you're not well-equipped enough, that thing will tear you apart. Plus... the AI on those boars are silly (And I feel should be 'neutral').

4. With the loss of the old NW Vault and the fact that I haven't kept up with all the overrides I've gotten over the years, I'd probably be of no help here. I know I use Amethyst Dragon's colored spell/class/feat icons, but the rest I'll have to figure out. Hopefully someone did an updated CEP head override to make them available in character creation (If we don't set up to use NWNCX's preload ability already) and the .2da override to unlock the voice sets. The last two I could certainly use.

If we were to add new hak files (Which seems to have become the new norm), I'd start poking into Project Q stuff if it were allowed and more easily obtained by others. I highly dislike their current method of sharing their files currently, but that's just me. I'm still loving the outfits in there.

[fealhach2008]

Any chance we could make the spawn points more random? Either their locations or, even better, what is spawned there.

Almost everyone who plays on the server can tell you where the spawns and their triggers are, and what they'll face.

Some of the wilder places could even produce encounters with more unusual beasties than the usual ogres or orcs.

Variety is the spice of life!

[TheMadPoet]

Sorry, the PRC I've worked with to. It's a pain to implement and worse to merge. I know there are some versions out there but with the resource limit already pretty close to full I'm not comfortable adding such a huge system in.

I personally love Q, however it is really kind of a pack of its own. Adding it in would require LOTS of 2da rewrites and new palette items. However removing certain overrides from Q and adding them in is well within our ability to do. It would require us to either make a community override, or a community hak pak.

Could you post the list and start the countdown?

I think we should make our own hak. Maybe only one is needed, and something that is custom made that way it fits well into what we already have and can easily be messed with later. Perhaps we should all link to our suggestions for content for it if everyone is okay downloading one extra hak pak?

I will definitely look into sprucing up the camp with some extra lanterns.

Dylan_The_Rabbit: Would you mind reposting your suggestions? I don't really want to have to hunt through every post while I am involved in this and having everything in one area would be a big help for me to refer to.

[Neutral_Zone]

3. I'd touch some of the spawns as well to make them less crazy and more forgiving for low-leveled characters. Wolverines are still the most terrifying creature to spawn when you're only, what, level 4? If you're not well-equipped enough, that thing will tear you apart. Plus... the AI on those boars are silly (And I feel should be 'neutral').

If we were to add new hak files (Which seems to have become the new norm), I'd start poking into Project Q stuff if it were allowed and more easily obtained by others. I highly dislike their current method of sharing their files currently, but that's just me. I'm still loving the outfits in there.

I've been fighting with the boars for a while, actually. I'll probably just make a new blueprint for them, since I don't want to mess with the base NWN AI too much (It is twitchy and prone to hiccups). I do have some experimental AI files for animals, but they're still in alpha and don't work properly... The default NWN AI overrides my changes (Annoyingly stupid...). Before, I didn't fix the boars because we had like 500 resources of space to use. We have a fair bit more room now, but I still don't like adding new resources, since it can cause other problems too.

Speaking of which, if anyone is good with coding and doesn't mind dealing with super-frustrating bugs, I'll throw my experi-mental animal AI at you and you can have fun with it. Basically, the idea was to get animals that act realistically; only fight when cornered, flee when overwhelmed, etc etc... It was part of  my entire rebuild of the NWN AI (Which, although fully conceived and planned, never got very far in terms of actual implementation.).

I personally would like to have some more music in the module. I get that a lot of people nowadays just turn off the music in NWN because it gets so repetitive, but I like it for atmosphere. So we could add in some sort of .2da override that allows the music to be selected builder-side and played back in the client - that way, if players don't have the music pack we use, they don't get locked out of the module. A sort of optional addition.

I've also got a custom override that widens the chat bars for higher resolution screens, so that more text fits in it before looping over to the next line. Currently the only version is for 1280 width, but I can make some ones for other screen sizes. I should probably upload these to the new vault, actually.

Any chance we could make the spawn points more random? Either their locations or, even better, what is spawned there.

Almost everyone who plays on the server can tell you where the spawns and their triggers are, and what they'll face.

Some of the wilder places could even produce encounters with more unusual beasties than the usual ogres or orcs.

Variety is the spice of life!

This is actually a good idea; I'm tired of fighting with the default NWN spawn system that for some reason like presenting level 14 players with CR 20 encounters. I've actually already got a mostly-made spawn system that I can insert into the module. It is a big project, though, and I'll have to redraw all the triggers and stuff, so it'll be something I experiment with over time and implement bit by bit - you'll probably see this affecting the Wyverns and Bounties the most.

[Tails1879_]

Could you post the list and start the countdown?

Think two weeks is sufficient enough? I'll go ahead and include *every* player house just so we're thorough enough and keep a log on the forums.

[TheMadPoet]

I think 3 would be more than fair.

[fealhach2008]

I've actually already got a mostly-made spawn system that I can insert into the module. It is a big project, though, and I'll have to redraw all the triggers and stuff, so it'll be something I experiment with over time and implement bit by bit - you'll probably see this affecting the Wyverns and Bounties the most.

There're areas that are pretty much dead (or nearly dead) where all kinds of random spawn fun could happen - Southern Ruins, the Mere, Stillness Swamp, the Crags (now the Luskan sea route is open.)

Possibly even a second bounty board that involves monster-slaying? Something like a mini boss fight that's a lot more challenging than the 'single combat' feel I get from Luskan bounties.

[TheMadPoet]

Instead of replacing the existing spawn system (a very difficult task) it might be better to redo the spawns in existing areas that don't see much play. For example the cave in the gypsy area. I agree with redoing the Mere of Dead Men quite a bit. And the crags could use some loving.

I also love the idea of monster-slaying boards. Some real tough creatures could be made that way.

[fealhach2008]

I was passing by the Prancing Badger Inn the other day, and this is another area that never gets used. We have a tavern where potential patrons run the risk of receiving Crippling Strikes from the bandits that wait outside!

The Inn is out of the way enough for no-one to bother going out there. Dealing with Greenfields' ne'er-do-wells bushwhacking travellers is not what you're in the mood for when you're looking forward to a relaxing pint with friends.

Could it be possible to move the bandits past the inn, placing their spawn point further north if not removing it completely? Also, making the Prancing Badger one of Niccolo's visiting sites could entice some custom to the area. It makes sense since it's close to his home (and Greenfields where he's bound to be having liaisons with some strumpet his poor wife is ignorant of!) 

[Tails1879_]

I was passing by the Prancing Badger Inn the other day, and this is another area that never gets used. We have a tavern where potential patrons run the risk of receiving Crippling Strikes from the bandits that wait outside!

The Inn is out of the way enough for no-one to bother going out there. Dealing with Greenfields' ne'er-do-wells bushwhacking travellers is not what you're in the mood for when you're looking forward to a relaxing pint with friends.

Could it be possible to move the bandits past the inn, placing their spawn point further north if not removing it completely? Also, making the Prancing Badger one of Niccolo's visiting sites could entice some custom to the area. It makes sense since it's close to his home (and Greenfields where he's bound to be having liaisons with some strumpet his poor wife is ignorant of!) 

I agree on the spawns being moved from there, though not removed completely. I could see them either being simply north of the inn by the abandoned tower, or in the next area over with the orcs. For my high-levels, they're more of a nuisance. "Damn it, now I have to kill them. I just wanted to see the hin!"

I could have sworn Niccolo once spawned there in the inn, but not anymore. I'll take a look at that.

On the topic of hak files, CEP 2.60 was released a couple days ago. However, there's some issues being reported about CEP tilesets in use causing crashes both in the game and toolset. The file "cep2_add_tiles2.hak" from 2.4 was reuploaded while the issue is being handled. Check it out here: http://neverwintervault.org/cep

EDIT: Took a quick look at some of the stuff added in. I like.